Undecideds: Why I’m Doing a 180 and Voting For Hillary
by Stuart O'Neill(If you are still undecided today then here’s a thought: If you want ‘change’, and we all do, then you have to have a change agent that knows the system and has the contacts to create that change. Perhaps my thoughts as I did a 180 degree turn to support Hillary Clinton will be helpful.)
So how did I come to a momentous change 180 degree change? Since I am grounded in Practical Politics, my first concern in any election is winning.
Whoever we pick as the Democratic nominee will be attacked as if they have stinking, slimy baggage by the Republican Party, the nominee and, more importantly, the slimy political world that surrounds the GOP. These ‘independent’ organizations have a sole purpose: to attack relentlessly, in the most vicious possible ways, the Democratic nominee. There will never be a ‘clean’ candidate that is exempt from their attacks.
Who, then, I began to think is best equipped to handle the vicious, continuous attacks that the other side will launch? So who could best stand up and fight?
Hillary Clinton has, as she has said, taken this incoming fire for 15 years or more. She’s had her patriotism questioned, her sexuality questioned, been accused of being a murderer, been accused of much more and yet she’s still the leading candidate for the Democratic nomination.
She’s tougher than boot leather while having a human side. Those are assets that our candidate needs. Hillary Clinton has developed thick skin and the ability to remain calm in campaign combat. Yet, she also knows how to listen to the American people.
Qualifications? She’s a successful, liberal US Senator. She’s won a Senate election that was none too clean by fighting back and campaigning in the non-traditional places in NY. She went to conservative, Republican based northern rural areas and won them over with smart policies, substantive talk and the fact she simply listened! In that most unlikely of places, she won with 67% of the vote. And then in 2006 she won re-election.
I like that she sticks to policy and not continuous personal attacks when she talks, but I also like that she also takes the time to listen when she’s campaigning. (I can testify that having a candidate disciplined enough to force herself to listen to others when it would be so much easier to rush to the next event is unusual in itself.)
I am convinced that Hillary is strong where others, including Barack Obama, would be weak and inexperienced. She will fight the filth machine of the other side with vigor and calmness. She knows how to outmaneuver them.
She’s a warrior. It’s a term seldom applied to women. Yet being a warrior is what she’s been from her Watergate committee staffing experience, through several terms as the First Lady of Arkansas, working on multiple corporate boards fighting for equal rights for workers and women and during her years as First Lady of the US traveling the world. She learned first hand in those travels the foreign issues and realities. Hillary Clinton has made the personal contacts that are will be so valuable in the White House. She has consistently fought for the underdog and the American people. She was a warrior without anyone using the term.
Hillary Clinton knows how to form coalitions on Capitial Hill to get the job done! She has, that ‘bad’ word this election cycle, ‘experience’. JFK, perhaps one of the most inspirational speakers in his day, had 8 years US Senate experience and had taken a run at the Vice Presidency in 1956. He knew government from the inside.
JFK was not an outsider condemning the system and all those in it. If you want change in government you first have to learn how to operate from the inside to get the laws and policies changed. We learned this time and time again from JFK to Bill Clinton.
Hillary Clinton, to use her term and much to my surprise, is ‘my gal’. I will vote for her today and in the general election.
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Here. Here. Glad to have you on board. Hillary is tough. Hillary is smart. Hillary is tested and she’s still here!
Hillary’s toughness is one very good reason to support her candidacy in the primaries. That same relentless, nose-to-the-grindstone methodology will also help her navigate the treacherous waters of the presidency.
I read a great column in today’s Oakland Tribune outlining her capacity as a “Transactional” leader. It’s worth checking out.
Clinton in 2008!!!
I was torn too, but in the final equation Hillary has what it takes to win.
-Kevin
Hillary is the last best chance that the US has to reclaim their place in the world as the leading and most influential power - a resounding voice for progressive thought that would ring around the world.
And the US is going to blow it again by picking Obama so that he can be swift boated on his drug past/Rezko etc in the general election.
As an international observer - I just find it to be distressing and disheartening.
I had such high hopes for the american people. I really did.
As a young person, I was leaning towards Obama. He seemed Fresh and New and was against the war. But after I thought about it, what do I really know about Obama? Maybe not knowing is a good thing.
Obama is the Hot, Popular Girl in School everyone drools over. Yes, it’s great going on a couple of dates with her until you get to know her. Then you discover that the allure was the beauty and the mystery, but there is NO way you’re Marrying her.
Hillary is the marrying kind of gal. She’s not flashy and not into Designer Clothes and Hot Spot Clubs, but she’s the kind that will work hard and help you raise a family.
I guess, for me, I had my last minute fling, but I did the honorable thing and picked the girl I know will raise Our Country!
Hillary is a tried candidate … she has been “knocked to the matt” and gotten back up and is still standing. She does this with a cool head. We have no idea what Obama will do because he has never been put to the test in any way similar. I think the Obama camp thinks the republicans will play nice with him because he is such a good guy and a nice speaker. People respond to that that he came up through Chicago politics and that’s a tough place. But, he won his seat in the Senate through a series of disasters by his opponents … not by any great record or fight of his own. My nephew described his rallies as being like seeing a “rock star”. I don’t want an inexperienced rock star running my country. I want the best qualified person running my country.
I agree with you. Hillary is tested and has a record of proven of results. Obama is extremely affected by attacks and to this point has been protected by the Press. Hillary and the media have not focused on Obama’s weaknesses but the Republicans most certainly would. To get change you have to know how the system works. The more experience the better you become at what it takes to get change. Hillary is the best candidate to stay focused on the issues that will change America in a positive direction.
Mike
Great posts Rick & Mike. The cable news/mainstream media has given Obama a free pass and has not questioned him at all in regards to his past and affiliations. Obama’s minister/advisor is an anti-white, anti-American, anti-Semitic man. This man (Jeremiah Wright) is a friend of Louis Farrakhan and has some very scary beliefs. Add this dark side of Obama to his ties with Exelon Energy Co., Rezko, and you get a disaster. It’s getting very hard for me to stomach his empty rhetoric with absolutely no substance. This is not the person to lead this country. We need someone with real knowledge of foreign policy and the ability to get things done and that’s why I support Hillary.
I really liked this article because it responds indirectly to the Caroline Kennedy NY Times Op-Ed piece (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/27/opinion/27kennedy.html?em). I am glad that Hillary won in California, where I live. This election has been so hard for me to decide, however. Walking to the polls, today, with my husband, and 5-yr old son, I was still undecided. I stood at the polls staring at the bubble, Obama, or Hillary? I voted for Obama today, but then afterward, did not feel good about it. I had decided I was voting for Hillary at 3 pm today, I voted at 6 pm. Between 3-6 pm today, I got myself confused. It started when I answered the phone call from my neighbor, a volunteer Precinct captain for Obama. And, my confusion continued after reading Caroline Kennedy’s NY Times article endorsing Obama, which my neighbor had suggested I read. In fact, this article swayed me toward Obama. I chose to vote for Obama today, yet as I said, after voting, I did not feel good about it. I allowed myself to be swayed, particularly by Caroline Kennedy’s op-ed piece. It is just after midnight on Super Tuesday, and now I know that California went to Hillary. I was relieved in a way. I hope Hillary gets the Democratic nomination, and that her campaign picks up momentum over the next month. I only wish that I had given my vote to Hillary, and had stuck to my original reasons for voting for Hillary, which are that she is the more experienced candidate, and I like her follow through, and stick-to-it-ness. For other undecided voters, in states that vote post-Super Tuesday, go with your own decision; do not let others sway you last minute. If you think Hillary will do a good job, give her a chance.
What saddens me about this election is the press resurrecting race as an issue, which makes good ratings but shouldn’t be the case and is not the case in my world or in how my children have been brought up. As I watch the news channels reporting Obama got large percentages of the ‘black’ vote it sickens me the media has actually created that issue. My home always had kids of varied ancestries over, and I always taught my kids to see people for who they are, not where there grandparents were born, please don’t take that away, not here, not now!
People should vote for the person who through years of hard work has always had their back. Hillary has always been there for those that need her advocacy the most. There are very few people men or woman, of every ancestry who could have taken the attacks this woman has taken and rather than crumble, learned from each and emerged stronger. The Republicans gave her their worst (with our money) and she was amazing. The press has called her cold when she was strong, and attacked her when she showed any emotion. From what I have seen of Hillary, as one of her constituents, I can honestly say she isn’t lying when she says nobody is invisible to her. I believe she is our last best hope to save the American Dream from those who choose to go back to the days of a two class monarchy. Isn’t that what our ancestors risked everything to run away from?
True we all like to have hope, but if we live in hope without action we will die in despair. Hillary has the knowledge, the organization, the connections, the respect of her colleagues on both sides of the isle and oceans of the world, plus is brilliant to boot. True respect is earned through years of hard work in gaining the people’s trust and from what I have seen Hillary has done just that, please give her a look, open your mind, read her books, study her work record. If you don’t agree with every one of her decisions (and I don’t, but there hasn’t been a mortal person yet whose every decision I’ve agreed with) look at the big picture.
I understand the young want “change” but change isn’t always for the better. In this time, probably the darkest in our history, we need someone who can bring about change for the better, who can give us back our country and I believe that would be Hillary!
Truer words have not been written. My wife and I live in Georgia and we were and now divided on who we think should be the Party’s nominee for President. She is for Obama and I’m for Hillary.
Talk about a house divided!
We are both African-American and unfortuneatly, Hillary lost Georgia due to no small part to the heavily lopsided African-American tilt towards the Obama camp. While I personally found this event a little disappointing, I know deep down that I made the right choice yesterday.
When we went to our polling place I was admittedly second guessing my upcoming decision: should I go with who I KNOW to be our best chance to get experienced, sane, nuanced, intelligent and engaged leadership back into the White House?Or should I go with the fresh, just as (I believe) intelligent, reacher-across-the-aisles, new hope guy?
Keep in mind, because he is MY dream, a Brother who has a real chance of obtaining the highest office in the land, an eloquent transcender of the gutter race-politics that define or defined both parties’ histories; I thought I owned him the participation of my dream. Hillary, will afterall energize the Repubs in an unholy furor to get to the polls to defeat her (and us, the American People).
Then I remembered the Paul Krugman op-ed piece I read the day before. Basically, he reminded us that Obama will be savaged as well…but won’t have the decades-long honed ability to return gut-punch after gut-punch that I KNOW Hillary has.
They won’t play nice just because he believe they will be willing to throw away the old style of ‘doing things’.
They won’t even if this country burns around them.
So I made the decision to go with Hillary.
Why?
Because I remember the ’90’s. I remember I was able to purchase my first house. I remember we were admired and respected around the world. I remember millions of jobs being created.
I remember.
I want that for all of us again.
Could not have said it better myself. Experience, seasoning, staying power. It matters! When the republican attack machine got going on Obama and his comments re: bombing Pakistan, sitting down with Iran and Cuban leaders, being for/then against decriminalizing marijuana laws, his church (most unfortunately!), etc., it would be a blood bath.
Women deserve to make the same salaries as men, the same opportunities as men!
LADIES LETS MAKE HISTORY FOR OUR GRANDMOTHERS, MOTHERS AND DAUGHTERS!!!
Mrs. Ladybird Johnson Former First Lady, United States of America. Women can move beyond the struggle for equal status and for material goods to the challenges and opportunities of citizenship. I always hope that the very best of our people will go into politics and some of our best are women. So, I say: “Don’t hold back. Don’t be shy. Step forward in every way you can to plan boldly, to speak clearly, to offer the leadership which the world needs. To pluck out prejudice from our lives, to remove fear and hate where it exists, and to create a world unafraid to work out its destiny in peace. Eleanor Roosevelt has already made her own splendid and incomparable contribution to that foundation. Let us go and do likewise, within the measure of our faith and the limits of our ability. Let Eleanor Roosevelt teach us all to turn the arts of compassion into the victories of democracy. Eleanor Roosevelt taught us that sometimes silence is the greatest sin. VOTE CLINTON 2008
Way to go Hillary!!!
Hillary is not afraid to make tough decisions and will not just “be present” when we need her to stand up for us like our rock star “Michael Jackson” opponent.
She is a walking testimony that she will stand up for and with America never leaving or forsaking us. Obviously, family is a very deep root and an important foundation to her. I admire her for holding her family and Christian beliefs above the media and their rhetoric!
I think everyone voting for her would agree she is our “wonderwoman” and can be tough as leather when she needs to be and she doesn’t need flashy speeches and rock music for subliminals to young minds.
She is the ONLYy candidate who can beat the republicans! WE CAN’T AFFORD THE THIRD GIVE-AWAY IN A ROW TO REPUBLICANS LIKE GORE AND KERRY HAVE DONE.
Obama’s charm will have no meaning to any democrat in the end and definitely won’t beat the republicans!
Hillary will fight for this election to the end. SHE TRULY LOVES AND CARES FOR AMERICA!
This is the first time I’ve had the opportunity to drop into the discussion thread. I appreciate the thoughts, the experiences (particularly Marc from Red state) and the links to new artlicles. Thanks to Freccia for the new link.
Thanks to you all.
BTW: We made the top of HillaryHub yesterday. In the knife on DKos yesterday as I made the post there I found out we are now seen as a “Hillary” site. They don’t seem to understand there are more author and many viewpoints.
ya know i WISH hillary would use the power of VISUALS that obama uses. he is all talk and do you ever notice that his shots at any event pan back and around so you can see the crowds. this is a subtle way of telling the viewers that HE is the one everyone is going to see. W hen hillary speaks it is a tight shot usually showing the stage andf those in back of her. USE the POWER of VISUALS like the obama campaign does. You have ENORMOUS outcomes PLEASE US this to your benefit. Obama is trying to sway people into thinking their are more people for him then you, which is NOT TRUE. I hope to see this visual aspect addressed the next time i see you speak> you go girl and congrats on your winnings yesterday. I plan on voting for you and wil do so in March in TEXAS!!!!
I’m an European girl.
Here and around the World, all experts say:
Hillary is the only Democrat who can Beat McCain.
There is an IMPRESSIVE Hillary trailer in YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlATFrHhMQc
Please, let’s show her this wonderful trailer.
This should be her campaign ad!!!!
I watched, with fists clenched, the primary returns last night, praying for Hillary Clinton! She needs some divine intervention to get a fair shake from the media. For example, I usually watch MSNBC, particularly Hardball and Countdown but I have had enough. I flipped back and forth between CNN and MSNBC - CNN actually tried to present the returns objectively. it was quite different on MSNBC - every one of their hosts, Chris Matthews, Keith Olberman, are bent on distorting her record, achievements, etc. Instead, we are being force-fed Obama!
Yes, he is attractive and a great speaker — but what exactly has this one-term Senator actually done to deserve the toughest job in the world? Will someone please explain this to me? I don’t get it!
Hillary is the Democrat to Beat McCain
If John McCain becomes the Republican nominee, Hillary is the Democrat who can beat him — because she has the strength and experience a president needs to get America on the right course and to defend it against future threats. She is the hands-on leader that America needs as we slip into a worsening economic crisis. Her ability to be both a strong commander-in-chief and steward of the economy are what make her the favorite against Sen. McCain.
The 2004 election was determined by two key groups - women concerned about security and Latinos.
These are two groups that enthusiastically support Hillary.
So if Sen. McCain is the nominee, Hillary is the one well-positioned to beat him.
I was absolutely sickened by what happened in Connecticut (not just because I’m a New Yorker) and that shady turnaround in Missouri! Nonetheless, the media finds it hard to admit that Hillary had a great night! Consider:
New York, by a 17-point margin (of course);
New Jersey by 10;
Oklahoma by 24;
Tennessee by 13;
the big enchilada, California, by 10;
and … Massachusetts — How sweet it is — by 17, despite the endorsement of Ted “old politics” Kennedy and the “fairy-tale” spun by Caroline “he’s like my father” Kennedy. Not to mention the support of John Kerry and Gov. Deval Patrick!
I don’t have the Arkansas and Arizona figures at hand, but … you get my point.
I can’t wait to see the Sunday morning morons agonize over this.
Keep going, Hillary. We’re here for you!
I just wonder when the media will investigate Obama’s character and integrity. He has some issues and is trying to suppress them. I hope folks step to donate to HIllary’s campaign so she can compete.
What a fantastic comment thread. Many of you could author posts of your own. In fact I’m suggesting that those of you that are willing to do so put your thoughts into a succinct post and email it to me.
On my own blogs and perhaps here we’ll see they make the light of day.
Email me here
I have to echo what Roz Baker said early on in the thread — HRC is the best chance we have, and we’re gonna blow it yet AGAIN by playing it safe and going for the content-lite guy who we’re pretty sure won’t offend anyone. He’s as bland as every other Democratic loser has ever been, only he’s flashy enough to make people think they’re doing something daring by supporting him when he’s business as usual: content-free.
Barack Obama is like that mirror in the Harry Potter books: he has no content at all, but he reflects back to you your own fondest hopes and wishes. But just like that mirror, the only reason he can do that is because he’s blank.
He’s one more bland bowl of lukewarm vanilla ice cream, the latest in a long line of Democratic losers, starting with Walter Mondale and Michael Dukakis and ending with John Kerry. He’s gonna get the living daylights swiftboated out of him, and — just as happens every damned year — the Dems are going to blink and act shocked-by-god-shocked that it happened. Sucker punch them sixteen times and they still pout and act wronged when you do it the seventeenth time.
Obama is content-lite. In the words of the old saying, there’s no THERE there. And again, the Dems are going for the pretty speeches and the “reaching across the aisle” rhetoric that’s left them with their pants down for almost the last thirty years.
That doesn’t even begin to go near the way the Obama supporters have demonized Bill Clinton worse than Ann Coulter ever did. Why? Because he committed the foul sin of actually being the only Democrat in nearly thirty years who won an election? Well, heavens to betsy, they can’t listen to HIM! He has the unseemly stink of victory stuck to him.
And HRC is the only Dem in history who has built up enough antibodies to the Republican attack machine to actually be immune to it.
And, like Roz said, they’re gonna blow it. They’re gonna go for the bland guy who makes pretty speeches but hasn’t anything to his name, who can get swiftboated into insensibility precisely because he’s done next to nothing and can’t hold up under that sort of onslaught.
And we’ll be looking at four years of President McCain.
At this rate, the Dems don’t deserve to govern.
For all the Obama fans which is what you are because this is a race which appears more like a celebrity watch than a political one. Since when does inspiration handle the real issues. Since when does speeches from Obama about change but no substance or meat to them mean he’s ready to make change happen? Where’s his plan??? Or does he need to have Ted Kennedy or John Kerry speak for him or wait what about Oprah, Carolyn or any number of other “celebrities” to speak for him. Do you people not watch the debates with open eyes. He never answers any of the tough questions and it’s easy to say you didn’t vote for the war when you’ve taken the easy route of a “present” vote on many issues. People wake up! Obama doesn’t have the experience or know how to take on the tough issues. And as far as needing money - why should he raise any more dollars when he has CNN giving him free air time every chance they can get. Shame on you Wolf!
Hillary is the only one who’s taken on the tough issues. Most of her career has been working to help the poor, children and families. What has Obama done? Do some research on Obama and you’ll find he’s not as great as everyone would like to portray him to be. And while you’re at it look into Michelle Obamas past as well. She’s taken her fair share of money from the poor without having to do very much if anything. Does he not have to be held to the same standards as any of the other candidates? I didn’t realize the presidency was a popularity contest in which it’s easy to have other people do the talking for you.
Hillary is being attacked because she’s a strong, smart women like many working mothers today. Wake up America! Like it or not this is the year for Hillary to be president. Might I add she hasn’t done such a bad job with Chelsea either. She’s an inspiration to us all.
Hillary for President!!! We Love You and You Inspire Us. Keep on Fighting!
I agree with the comment Terry made earlier:: I just wonder when the media will investigate Obama’s character and integrity. He has some issues and is trying to suppress them. I hope folks step to donate to HIllary’s campaign so she can compete.
Terry, you know when the media will start investigating Obama and shredding him to tiny pieces?
After he wins the nom.
They WANT him in — because they are in thrall to their Republican bosses and want an easy, soft-stomached opponent for them. So they’re going easy on him and pre-emptively taking down the tougher opponent beforehand.
After HRC is safely out of the way … they are gonna take Obama down. Hard. He’s getting his *ss handed to him the second the convention wraps up.
Who cares who the Kennedy’s support. It didn’t help them in MA ans CA. JFK was a good talker but his brother RFK walk the walk, that’s why his son voted for Hillary. Chicago has a terrible record for education. One of the highest in the country. 75% of the Chicago’s schools are failing and they have a 50% dropout rate. What’s Obama doing about that?
My biggest fear concerning Obama is that his first act would be to send troops and millions of more dollars into Africa. Yeah Genocide is bad, but why do we always have to be the world mediator. The constitution says we are not to nation build. I agree when you say he acts like a rock star. He has the young masses brainwashed without producing any substance to his ranting.. He’s going to fold like an accordian when McCain starts spewing his accusations and rhetoric. We need some one who is tested and has the “kohonies” (not a real word) to go on the attack. I’m praying for you Hiillary.
Hillary for President
The comment from Janis posted at 7:57 is hardly civil. I just wanted to point out: Hillary had to loan her campaign money and her staffers are going without pay. You really want her to run our economy? In addition, she hired a speech and acting coach in October. Her tone when speaking has changed dramatically. It is much softer and more soothing. She has to fake likeability?
Now really, I have not heard ANYONE bring up the M word (Monica Lewinsky) lately. And you think they are going to have a hard time taking her down? I live in one of the most heavily Republican districts in Ca. They are drooling over the thought of running against her. The Dems I know who are active in politics cannot stand Hillary and are even thinking of changing parties if she is the nominee. The people I have talked to who did vote for her over-whelmingly said it was for this reason: she is a woman. The #2 reason was Bill. It was never her policies or positions.
Mike Remer
In ‘04 Kerry loaned his campaign money. Romney has done it on the Republican side. Many politicians work with voice coaches. It is quite common. Perhaps Obama wouldn’t need to use a teleprompter when he delivers speeches, if he did too.
I 100% agree Obama is getting a free pass by the media right now. I am in Illinois and am shocked so many people voted for him. After carefully checking their voting records, comparing their experience, and reviewing their major contributor lists I don’t see any contest here. We have seen the results of a cheerleader president. I also agree if Obama gets the nomination McCaine wil be our next president. There is no way someone with so few qualifications will get elected as Commander and Chief during war time.
Oh and Mike
You probably don’t hear anyone bring up the “M” word because it’s really old news and clearly Hillary Clinton has risen above that and showed her worth in the Senate and as her own person. Trust me they Repubs are salivating over running against Obama. They’re just not talking about it, because it would blow their game.
In your research, did you happen to come across the fact that Hillary has 8yrs experience as an elected official, while this year Obama will have had 11 yrs? Her time in the White House should NOT count. She never had the security clearance to be privy to national security issues. Many of her visits to foreign countries were done so with people like the comedian Sinbad. You are not responding to the Monica question. She has not had to personally take incoming fire from Repubs about her husband and his marital infidelities. If Hillary gets the nomination, McCaine will be Prez. All the polling indicates this. Many Dems will switch to Independents. As for the loan to her campaign, it was pointed out in a blog earlier that Hillary made the point to say the money loaned was HERS. That could be because if it was from Bill as well it would undergo scrutiny. He is getting 20 million from a new deal he made and probably doesn’t want that info disclosed. What exactly has Hillary accomplished to date that is so great?And voting records? Give me a break! She screwed up on the Iraq vote and does not have the guts to say it was a mistake. You think the Repubs won’t just eat that one up?
Old news as in what Mark Penn brought up regarding Obama and his past? Are you telling me that the Repubs won’t regurgitate Hillary and Bill’s past?
Mike Remer
FYI - Obama couldn’t be bothered to support Kerry Feingold in ‘06 and voted exactly the same Clinton has on Iraq, since he has been in the Senate — so personally I reject the idea that he is the anti-war candidate.
Clinton hjas already raised over 3 million today so chill on the loan. Like I said Kerry went through the same thing and there was similar scutiny about whether the money was his or Teresa’s.
There is nothing the Republicans can say on Monica which has not already been said and scrutinized. Obama however is whole new game and they will have plenty to make stick.
Any way thanks for sharing here. I’m so happy to have folks like you come along and comment here, it reinforces my support for Hillary Clinton.
My last word before I cleanse myself by donating to Obama and adding to the over 6 MILLION he raised in 24 hours by individual donors, not Pacs, lobbyists or corporations is this:
Character and integrity: Obama had the courage to speak out against the war in Iraq when it was a political liability for him to do so. The campaign Hillary has run leaves her sorely lacking in this department. It looks like she took more than a few pages right out of the Republican playbook that got Bush elected.
Mike
I got your Obama character and integrity right here - he didn’t have either when it came time to walk the talk in the Senate. He voted against Kerry Feingold and voted to fund the war. Yup, uh-huh, that’s what I call character and integrity. He backed down once he was in the Senate.
And oh, maybe just maybe there are a whole sector of voters in this country that don’t want a one issue candidate. It ain’t just about Iraq. I don’t think Obama gets that.
I served as a precinct captain at the caucus and attended the monthly meeting of the local Democrats the next night. I consistently heard these objections to Clinton’s election:
a) She just doesn’t motivate me and is part of the divisiveness we’ve seen all these years.
b) The Republicans hate her so much that those who might otherwise sit this one out will show up to vote against her.
c) Obama was always against the war and didn’t vote for it as she did.
New Yorkers who lived through 9/11 can testify to how they felt when they believed, like Clinton and most everyone else who was misinformed by Bushlings, that Iraq was responsible, and how important it was to them that their Senator was showing her compassion by attempting to protect them.
As for Obama’s claim that he didn’t vote for the war, I didn’t vote for it, either–of course, like Obama, I wasn’t in Congress myself…. Not being there, he had no more to risk than a city council member in not supporting the war. Obama has publicly stated that he’s not against all wars and has left the door open to sending troops wherever and whenever he wishes if he is elected. As a senator, he’s also voted to continue the war…something dismissed by Obama supporters as not worth considering.
There seemed to be general agreement at the caucus that the economy was well managed under former President Clinton and that candidate Clinton played a role in that.
There were several Obama supporters who had been well briefed on the caucus process and were knowledgeable about procedure. There were no official Clinton precinct representatives among the 41 people in our precinct caucus, though there were some at the school (where 10 precincts composed of 400 people caucused). Our precinct and the other 9 reflected the Colorado vote, unfortunately. It appeared that the Obama campaign was better organized.
After the straw poll, a few people spoke in favor of each candidate, but no one changed their votes. Even though there was some discussion about the vagueness of the proposed change Obama represents, people still said they wanted it. Despite a recap of Clinton’s community service, they felt he had done more, though none identified any particular accomplishment as a community organizer or a state legislator or U.S. senator…and though a Clinton supporter brought up the slumlord issue and Obama’s false claim that he’d gotten legislation passed when it actually failed. People are obviously voting their emotions.
At the monthly meeting of local Democrats Wednesday night, a state senator indicated his support for Obama (though he said Clinton would also make a fine president). After that he consistently referred to “the Clintons” whenever he talked about her possible election. I think people are both attracted to and repelled by this partnership. I hope the campaign can find the right horse whisperer to tame this mustang and ride it to a win. If a corporation were interviewing Hilary Clinton for CEO, they would be delighted that her husband was a former president and assume they would gain the benefit of a supportive spouse’s knowledge and experience. Like any high-quality asset, his contributions must be appropriately managed and Clinton and her team can do that. Plus there’s no reason to think that he will stop his lucrative business ventures and innovative philanthropic projects, both of which require considerable attention.
I asked the state senator whether charisma counts for much in Washington, whether politicians have built up their immunities to it, and whether horse-trading ability matters more. He responded that Obama would surround himself with expertise and would therefore be just as qualified as Clinton to run the country with the advice of his team. To me, this possibility opens up a big hole that the Obama campaign can fall into.
Obama has already stated his admiration for Ronald Reagan in some respects. Would we have another Reagan-Bush CEO-style administration, with Obama delegating too much power to others–who were not elected–because of his lack of experience and network?
The fact that Clinton clearly demonstrates the ability to manage the country on her own versus a presidency by committee is an advantage I haven’t heard emphasized enough.
As for who is backing them, both receive considerable financial support from industry donors, without which neither could be elected. It’s not an ideal world, folks.
Finally, I keep hearing people say the race is not about gender. I understand that this is a minefield, but I think it is definitely about gender in part. The move of white men who supported Edwards to Obama was not surprising–they’ve grown up with mixed-race men in school, the workplace and on sports teams. They may have more in common with Obama than with women. Like most people, they may automatically lean toward a male authority figure. There is also the well-studied phenomenon of male and female resistance to female authority, from mothers to teachers to managers. Has the campaign purposely avoided bringing in strong feminists such as Steinem and Morgan who might frighten the electorate? What they have written about misogyny and Clinton is accurate and depressing. It has not been a problem for Obama to bring champions of African American rights into his circle of supporters.
Imagine if someone had yelled, “Mow my lawn!” at Obama instead of, as actually happened, a man yelling, “Iron my shirts!” at Clinton. The media would have been all over this racist incident as indicative of national prejudice instead of just attributing it to the actions of one jerk. And what about the crude sexual toys modeled on Clinton? As far as I know, there are none—nor should there be–featuring Obama.
The media continues to attack Clinton for not being feminine enough and gives Obama a pass on all fronts.
And where is the praise for Clinton’s standing by her man and sacrificing her pride to keep her family together? Some of the same pro-family people who oppose divorce have criticized her. Hey! She and Chelsea were the victims here. No blaming the victim!
As reprehensible as it was for him to abuse his position by having sex with an underling, Bill Clinton’s philandering pales in comparison to that of the Kennedys. Perhaps Obama’s young supporters who idolize Jack and Teddy are unaware—or don’t care—about the moll JFK shared with a mobster (and whose pillowtalk compromised state secrets), the Secret Service escorts to nighttime White House pool parties (without the First Lady), and the deaths of Marilyn Monroe and Mary Jo Kopechne. JFK’s connections to Chicago and Las Vegas gangsters led to a partnership resulting in the Bay of Pigs fiasco in Cuba. Though I voted for him, I know now that much of the credit he gets for domestic legislation rightly belongs to LBJ, a lifelong politician who (despite or due to some arm-twisting tactics) believed in helping the poor and oppressed and could push a civil rights agenda forward.
As for politically active youth, is anyone organizing the cadre of young feminists out there for Clinton? And where are the endorsements of Clinton from women’s organizations?
Clinton should behave in a civil manner and demonstrate her diplomatic ability in the way she deals with Obama. We don’t want someone who will embarrass us internationally by bullying a la George Bush. She should give the public a feeling of security that she will keep us out of war and use that money to rebuild America’s infrastructure and support small business. Perhaps she can commit to transferring specified millions from the Iraq war to education, economic development and healthcare within specified time periods after her election.
I know she has an agenda for winning hearts and minds internationally without resorting to coercion, but we need to hear more about it–bread and roses, not guns. She might support the move for a cabinet-level Department of Peace that will have a budget to pursue nonviolent alternatives to international problems. Imagine if we devoted even a tenth of the Department of Defense budget to such efforts! And we already have some people trained to deliver such services who will need jobs when the military comes home, for many soldiers have spent most of their time on issues such as getting water to communities in Iraq.
I agree that she needs to demonstrate more compassion. People need to feel their President could be their friend. I’d like to see films and stories featuring individuals Clinton helped when she did community service, images of her as a regular person, e.g., playing music, playing with her dog, canoeing with her daughter, enjoying an outing with friends and extended family, etc., but only things that she really does. Genuineness is essential.
And Clinton has it, though showing it doesn’t come as easily to her as it does to the more outgoing Obama. Of course, no one is going to criticize Obama for being ballsy.
I was originally an Edwards supporter but even before he dropped out of the race I started to lean towards Hillary Clinton. The reason? Because in every single debate she showed that she is a leader and that she is smarter than any other candidate that was running. Her take on the economy is right on, as well as her plans for health care. I also think she’s well more versed when it comes to foreign policy and national security.
The reason I don’t like Obama is because I’m from Chicago and I’ve seen him in action. All those progressives who thinks he is the great hope for American had better look again. I’ve written many posts about his dealings in Chicago such as Rezko and Exelon and also pointed out how many times he’s either fudged the truth or out right lied…but those who come to my blog say that they will vote for him anyway because he gives them hope. I don’t get it….it reminds me of the way the right wingers cling to Bush no matter how much he has done to destroy our country. I’m so sick of this strange adoration for Obama.
Of course, the news media doesn’t help. For days before Super Tuesday there was nothing but a love fest for Obama and for Hillary they kept saying she “cried again!”
Now, I find out Hillary is in dire need of campaign funds. I only wish I had enough to help. I am going to donate $25, it’s all I can afford.
I did vote for Hillary in Illinois and hope that she will be our candidate for President.
This article was well done and hits several of Hillary’s strong points. I am a REPUBLICAN from ARIZONA. However, I am supporting Hillary in this campaign, not because she is a woman but because I believe she will make the best possible next President for the U.S.A. She is a fighter against the toughest odds. But we all know that she has a heart and even when it has been broken (by Bill) that she still finds it in her heart to forgive. She placed her faith in God to help her through the toughest times. She is one of the most intelligent and capable people willing to work on both sides of the aisle and always works for children and the poor.
I proudly support Hillary for this election and have for the first time in my life (my own 180 turnaround) been willing to back up my support with a contribution of both some money as well as my time as a volunteer.
This is exactly what is wrong - “fighting the filths machine” - it is exactly what Bill was mostly doing his 8 years in the office. Do we want another 8 years of those fighters with ” leather skin” - who was “accused to be murderers” ??
No we do not need all this filth, and all this dirt, and all those Clintons. She never will be the President, if she will be nominated than our next President is Mr. John McCain. Maybe this is really Clinton’s plan? To get McCain is the office - he is very old - the chances are high that he will serve only 4 years. Then Clintons will take another chance for the White House in 2012 ?
Mary Ellen: “I’ve written many
posts about his dealings in Chicago such as Rezko and Exelon and
also pointed out how many times he’s either fudged the truth or out
right lied…but those who come to my blog say that they will vote
for him anyway because he gives them hope. I don’t get it.”
I remember hearing a comment made by Geraldine Ferraro in an interview where she said that she was once talking to a bunch of people in the Midwest during the 84 election, asking them why they supported Reagan even though his policies put every last one of them out of work, and they were standing there jobless. she said they replied with, “He made America stand tall.” At that point, she said she felt like packing it in — it was clear that they didn’t care about their jobs, didn’t care about actual policies, didn’t care about reality. They had bought the buzzword, game over. When peiople make decisions for stupid reasons, there is absolutely no arguing with them. They want to believe, so they clap their hands and stick their fingers in their ears and ignore reality.
That’s what people are doing with Obama — his Reagan-admiration comes from a very real place — content-free, empty image. The problem is, Reagan was able to do that after being elected once — Obama hasn’t been swiftboated yet and will get blown apart like a piece of wet kleenex.
But at least He Gives Them Hope. you can argue until you’re bluei n the face, but they want their pacifier over reality, and they will cling to it in the face of all evidence to the contrary. If I don’t lose my own job in November after McCain gets elected, I may take pleasure in gloating at them over it, but instead of owning teh blame for picking the wrong horse, I anticipate they will turn around and savage anyone who warned them ahead of time. “This is all your fault, Cassandra! If you hadn’t said anything, there wouldn’t have been any soldiers in that horse!”
America is tragic comedy.
One more quick comment — if Obama supporters think they are being precious or prim by disapproving of my hells and damns … yall are in for one rude shock when the Republicans start in on him, aren’t you?
You aren’t coming across as proper and civilized, you’re coming across as naive — and you will get flayed.
“My last word before I cleanse myself by donating to Obama and adding to the over 6 MILLION he raised in 24 hours by individual donors, not Pacs, lobbyists or corporations is this:
Character and integrity: Obama had the courage to speak out against the war in Iraq when it was a political liability for him to do so. The campaign Hillary has run leaves her sorely lacking in this department. It looks like she took more than a few pages right out of the Republican playbook that got Bush elected.”
Obama’s speech was really admirable. So was his promise to not vote for funding the war. That’s why I’m wondering why Obama took his anti-war speech off his website when he was running for the US Senate, and why he said he didn’t know how he would have voted in 2004.
So much for not caring about political liability. When the real test comes, Obama fails. Just read about his Exelon dealings.
Hillary is the one that can take on the horrendous job of cleaning up after the Bush debacle. The Media gave Bush a pass in 2000, now it seems as though they are giving Obama a pass in this election cycle. He doesn’t display the grit that will be needed for this new president. We contributed $50.00 at a time when we don’t have any extra money. Please get out there and help Hillary win.
It was $100 for me — and it was also a stretch to be able to do it. But it’s worth it to me, even just as a thank-you to a woman who has continually come out and fought for a country that seems not only determined to stab her in gratitude, but to follow it up by hurling itself into the toilet AND flushing.
And you know, if she pulls it out and wins, she’ll have the ex-Obama fans after her throat just as much as the Republicans are.
Democrats amaze me. Yall rip down your own high-fliers. What is your problem with success? Why the hell are yall so afraid of actually fighting to win? Every single election with the exception of the Awful Bill Clinton Isn’t He Just Terrible, you’ve gone out of your way to turn aside the whip-smart, tough-as nails, two-fister fighter on the side of light and gone after the prim, proper, soft-stomached guy who can’t take a punch! What IS it with you people?
Sorry, but this really bugging me. I’ve seen this happen every damned election with the exception of Bill Clinton’s two. You have an absolute genius at picking people made of tissue-paper, and acting gobsmacked when they get peeled like an onion. Will yall please KNOCK IT OFF?
I thought it was just me. I’m glad to see others have noticed how the media is not picking Obama to pieces. I think the Republican media (sometimes the Dem friendlys too) are leaving him alone. The hidden agenda (which there always is one) is to get the nomination to Obama. That’s when no stone will be left unturned about his lack of accomplishments, shady business dealings, etc. He is a great speaker; but it seems his comments are pretty much all flufff in my opinion.
The GOP has always been afraid of Hillary; Obama is just a means to ‘their’ desired goal (getting a Republican (looks like that’s going to be McCain now). They want a Democratic nominee they can beat. McCain can’t beat Hillary; but he can beat Obama.
Mike: “She screwed up on the Iraq vote and does not have the guts
to say it was a mistake. You think the Repubs won’t just eat that
one up?”
Not without admitting they screwed the pooch on Iraq in the first place, which they wouldn’t dare do. They’d hang themselves on that one first, child.
Hillary, a liberal?
The Texas primary is on March 4. For the first time in a generation, Texans’ votes will help determine the party’s nominee. Expect both the Obama and Clinton campaigns to spend a lot of time and money courting your vote. Your vote is very important.
In light of this, I cannot help but tell my family, friends, and fellow Texans why I will not be casting a ballot for Hillary Clinton on March 4. Yes, I realize it’s odd that I am talking about who I am not voting for, rather then waxing love struck about the other candidate; in fact, I am not particularly enthusiastic about the name I will click somewhat ambivalently on the touch screen voting machine (which may well render my vote meaningless through either mechanical error or deliberate tampering).
But I will vote for Obama. I am not convinced that he’s a genuine candidate of change his ardent supporters believe he is and that most Americans – of all political persuasions – are desperate for; but I am willing to give him a chance. Many of his policies are similar or identical to Clinton’s, but there are also key differences between the two: namely, that Obama may prove to be less beholden to elite corporate interests. A telling comparison is this: Clinton graduated from Yale Law in 1973, moved with Bill Clinton to Arkansas, and joined the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock - the oldest, most established firm west of the Mississippi, whose clients include Tyson Foods, Wal-Mart, large brokerages and banks; Obama graduated from Harvard Law in 1991 and returned to Chicago, where he led a voter registration drive, taught Constitutional law at the University of Chicago, and joined the Miner, Barnhill & Galland firm, where he represented community organizers, discrimination claims, and voting rights cases.
I will not vote for Hillary Clinton because:
1. She voted for the Iraq War Resolution, which has thus far claimed the lives of nearly 4,000 American servicemen and women, left more than 29,000 wounded, and has resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, as well as untold numbers of coalition military personnel, contractors, and humanitarian workers.
2. She voted for the USA PATRIOT Act, which, in the name of fighting terrorism, unconstitutionally strips U.S. citizens and others of their rights to due process, unreasonable search and seizure, and other basic freedoms. The Act gives the government the power to access to your medical records, tax records, information about the books you buy or borrow without probable cause, and the power to break into your home and conduct secret searches without telling you for weeks, months, or indefinitely; it gives the government the power to redefine “terrorism” to include a number of activities fundamental to American liberty and thus attempts to outlaw the right to dissent (which has happened before, during other wars). The Act expands government power to seize assets without a prior hearing, and without being convicted of a crime. The Act allows for the indefinite detention of immigrants and other non-citizens without trial. The Act permits a vast array of information gathering on U.S. citizens from school records, financial transactions, Internet activity, telephone conversations, information gleaned from grand jury proceedings and criminal investigations to be shared with the CIA (and other non-law enforcement officials) even if it pertains to Americans, information that can be shared without a court order. The Act allows the detention of people engaging in innocent associational activity. The Act is unconstitutional and un-American. Clinton, along with every other member of the Senate save Russell Feingold, who voted “Nay” and Mary Landrieu (who was “absent”), voted for the PATRIOT Act.
3. She voted for the No Child Left Behind Act, which continues the assault on American public education by disempowering teachers and local communities in favor of a devastating over-reliance on standardized testing. This system provides disincentives to lower performing students, no incentives to high-performing students, dominates class time that should be used for actual teaching, and, worst of all, ties performance to funding, which has resulted in even poorer public schools. The Act also facilitates military recruitment in elementary and secondary schools.
4. She voted for the Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act (another misnomer – it should’ve been called the “No Credit Card Company Left Behind Act”), which was opposed by a wide variety of groups, including consumer advocates, legal scholars, retired bankruptcy judges, and the editorial pages of many national and regional newspapers. The Act makes it much more difficult, if not impossible, for Americans to file Chapter 7 bankruptcy, under which some debts may be forgiven, and forces almost all debtors into Chapter 13, under which no debts may be forgiven. The Act includes provisions that prioritize the repayment of credit card debt over unpaid child support. The Act does nothing to curtail the predatory practices of credit card companies, such as exorbitant interest rates, rising and often hidden fees, and targeting minors and the recently bankrupt for new cards - which are themselves significant contributors to the growth of consumer bankruptcies.
5. She is a member of the Democratic Leadership Council, a powerful, corporate-financed mouthpiece within the Democratic Party that acts to keep Democratic candidates and platforms sympathetic to corporate interests and the interests of the wealthiest one percent. Her chief advisor, Mark Penn, who seems to be a conscienceless political pollster and operative in the mold of Karl Rove, has ties to Blackwater (a private mercenary army), corrupt foreign governments, and union-busters.
6. I oppose oligarchies, aristocracies, and any form of dynastic politics. In a country of 300 million people, is this really the best we can do? Twenty years of rule by two families? In a democracy, the people with the best ideas should rise to the highest leadership positions. Isn’t it obvious by now that we are not living in a real democracy? The sense of entitlement Clinton seems to have, coupled with the corporate media’s insistence for the past two years that she would be the inevitable Democratic nominee, is an insult to voters.
7. She is running Bill Clinton’s record, which is neither her own nor admirable. Clinton is now touting her “35 years of experience” – but experience doing what? She was a corporate lawyer, then First Lady of the United States. She has less legislative experience than Obama. If we give her credit for her husband’s accomplishments, we can thank her for:
a. the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), not a “trade” agreement, but an investment agreement whose core provisions granted foreign investors a remarkable set of new rights and privileges that promote relocation abroad of factories and jobs and the privatization and deregulation of essential services, such as water, energy and health care;
b. failure to establish a comprehensive health care plan in 1993; not only is mandating purchase of health insurance from private companies not “universal healthcare”, but the plan failed spectacularly – what evidence is there that now-Senator Clinton, who is backed by massive donations from HMOs, pharmaceutical companies, and health insurance companies, will be either able or willing to spearhead the kind of fundamental changes in health care Americans so desperately need?
c. the massive bombing of Iraq (along with several other countries) and sanctions against Iraq, which resulted in the deaths of an estimated 500,000 Iraqi children, and which then-Secretary-of-State and Hillary Clinton supporter Madeleine Albright famously said was “worth it”;
d. welfare “reform” – in which the Clinton administration, in collusion with the Republican Congress, acted as if getting mothers and their children off the welfare rolls is the same as getting them out of poverty, and which expanded the service-sector nature of the U.S. economy by increasing the number of Americans working dead-end, minimum-wage jobs while shifting practically all of the financial burden of poverty to the states;
e. the Telecommunications Act of 1996, which inevitably gave way to media consolidation as large corporations bought out smaller, independent and regional companies; this has inarguably resulted in a new media devoid of a variety of viewpoints necessary for a democracy to function, and has played a large part in the evolution of news in this country; what is now called “news” is often little more than corporate cheerleading and sophisticated stealth advertising. This is the news media that brought you the war in Iraq;
f. an economic “boom” that proved to be a bubble – Bill Clinton, as chairman of the DLC, did not take any substantial measures to improve the economy for the majority of Americans, instead simply continuing policies that benefit corporations and the richest one percent.
I do not oppose Clinton because I harbor some kind of irrational hatred of her, as demonstrated by many Americans on the right (who also seem to mistakenly believe she is a socialist). I oppose Clinton for the same reasons that I oppose McCain, Romney, Huckabee, and most other Republicans, as well as most Democrats: she represents a continuation of the domination of this country by a powerful, moneyed elite, and of America’s military domination of the world for the profit of this elite – to the detriment of the rest of us, in this country and abroad.
I have little faith that a vote for Obama will bring much “change”, either – but voting for Clinton will certainly change very little.
(footnotes on this are available on my blog)
Stella
“If we give her credit for her husband’s accomplishments, we can thank her for”
Hillary Clinton is not running on Bill’s record and you can’t put the ownous on her for anything you disagree with from the Clinton Adminstration. That is a ludicous notion.
Clinton/Obama - The Dream Team
Mike Remer needs to do his homework!
Hillary Clinton admittedly takes campaign contributions from lobbyists. During his speech Tuesday night, Sen. Obama said: “It’s a choice between a candidate who’s taken more money from Washington lobbyists than either Republican in this race and a campaign that has not taken a dime of their money.” On the contrary, Public Citizen just released a report detailing ten bundlers for Obama who have registered as federal lobbyists.
http://www.citizen.org/documents/LobbyistsFinal.pdf
Obama has also taken money from former lobbyists, partners of lobbyists, people who hire lobbyists, lobbyists’ spouses, and state lobbyists,
http://www.caclean.org/problem/latimes_2007-04-22.php
and until he started running for president, Sen. Obama took money from federal lobbyists and, as a state senator, directly from corporations.
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/08/09/pacs_and_lobbyists_aided_obamas_rise/
lob•by•ist [lóbbee ist] (plural lob•by•ists) noun. Somebody who lobbies political representatives: somebody who is paid to lobby political representatives on an issue .
Demonizing lobbyists is ignorant. Lobbying is how we educate our political representatives on issues that effect us personally or in our businesses. Do you think politicians are “all knowing”? We “the people” have to educate those who we have elected to represent us, as to how policies affect us. Not many of us have the time, talent or desire to meet face to face with policy makers to express our concerns and offer our advice. So we join organizations that have similar issues, pay our dues and hire lobbyists to take our concerns to Washington to be heard. Nothing in that strikes me as evil.
The problem is not lobbyists. It is not only in the misuse of the power given to these representatives and the abuse of our trust, but also with the expectation of favors and the surrendering to them. It is my opinion we have seen an abundance of pandering in the current administration.
I contend that, “Don’t say you don’t when you DO!” Don’t you think the republicans will use this against him in the General election campaign?
The problem is not that they accept the money. They do (and they all do), because it costs ridiculous amounts of money to get elected. The path to correcting this is in complete campaign finance reform!
“”If we give her credit for her husband’s accomplishments, we can
thank her for … ”
Managing to be part of the only Democratic administration that actually succeeded in winning an election, gosh isn’t that awful.
At this point, taking advice from anyone BUT the Clintons on getting into office is like taking advice from the Buffalo Bills on how to win the Superbowl. (In four times, choked four times, for those who don’t recall, and my sincere apologies to any Bills fans, but the analogy fits.)
“Just read about his Exelon dealings.”
We won’t need to, Emily. If Obama gets the nom, we’ll hear about them nonstop every single night on every news station in existence, starting the day after the convention closes.
“Tonight on Hardball — new allegations of corruption against Democratic golden boy Barack Obama! Could this spell the end of his rock star campaign? Next up after a word from our sponsors!”
HILLARY IS READY TO BEAT McCAIN and TO BE PRESIDENT
- Strengthening the Middle Class
- Providing Affordable and Accessible Health Care
- Ending the War in Iraq
- Promoting Energy Independence and Fighting Global Warming
- Improving Our Schools
- Fulfilling Our Promises to Veterans
- Supporting Parents and Caring for Children
- Restoring America’s Standing in the World
- A Champion for Women
- Comprehensive Government Reform
- Strengthening Our Democracy
- Reforming Our Immigration System
- An Innovation Agenda
- Creating Opportunity for Rural America
LOOK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlATFrHhMQc
I donated $200. to Hillary Clinton. I am a 50 year old working woman and living on a tight budget but it was worth every penny donating it to Hillary. I am computer savy and donated on-line.
Hillary is a strong candidate and knows the issues that are important to Americans. She is an amazing debator and can discuss issues clearly and in detail.
It will take a woman to clean up after GWB……….
I want the Democratic Dream-Team:
Clinton/Obama ‘08
If Hillary is the nominee, this ticket is possible.
HILLARY is not only a woman,
SHE is THE WOMAN !!
Well, I’ll start by saying I am currently an Obama supporter. First off, I don’t support him because of any media hype. I became interested before the media glorified him, and I personally think that the media has done him a disservice by not focusing on the content of his policies, and instead focusing on the whole “hope/change” thing. The “hope/change” thing is just a fluffy sort of bonus in my opinion.
I’ve seen a lot of people criticize Obama for not having “content.” Have you actually gone and read his policies? Not the quick summaries that are around everywhere, but the papers that he’s written up and provided for people to view?
Here’s a comparison:
(Note, I’m not saying Hillary is “content-lite’ or anything, just that they are equal)
Hillary Clinton’s plan for Rural America: 6.5 pages
Barack Obama’s plan for Rural America: 14 pages
Hillary Clinton’s plan for Energy/Environment: 14 pages
Barack Obama’s plan for Energy/Environment: 18 pages (Two documents)
Those numbers are based on the “Read the full plan” links on both candidates websites.
I’m not anti-Hillary, and I’m not even trying to convince you Obama’s policies are better (I think so, but do your own research), but I feel it’s fair to dispel the whole “content-lite” myth. If you have evidence that proves I’m wrong, please, tell me. But don’t claim without doing any sort of research.
Um … I have, Trevor. And if you could gauge them by the page count, doctoral committees’d weigh papers to decide who gets a degree and who doesn’t. Instead, they have this little thing called a defense where you have to DEFEND your ideas and show that you don’t only have the most words but the best ones.
Hillary’s plan has the RIGHT 6.5 pages. Obama’s goes nowhere in 14.
Well Janis, it’s your right to say what you think about them, and to defend them. I don’t think anywhere in there did I try to convince anyone that Clinton’s plans were the wrong ones. The point I’m trying to make is not about who is right or wrong. The point is that the content is there for people to make a decision (as you have done). I think Obama has a perfectly sound plan, and you think Hillary does (who said I don’t agree with you either?). Don’t belittle people just because they have a different viewpoint than you do. You’re ignoring the reason I posted so that you can turn it into an argument of “he’s right” “she’s right.”
Hey! What’s up with FL and MI? If those delegates counted, she would be A LOT farther ahead! It’s only because OB has been able to benefit by the state to state differences in the delegates he’s doing so well. Almost like GWB in the re-election, with all those ‘late votes’ made us take another term of this c***! It’s been a great term for all the oil people and the defense people, the rest of you just go work at some bull**** job and try to forget how these people basically took your freedoms and your money, too! This wonderful woman has the expertise and experience to make this corporation of America work for the ’shareholders’ not just the corporate big-wigs. God bless Her, and the American Dream!!
Trevor
First - understand that in reality neither Clinton or Obama wrote those plans. They were no doubt written by policy people on their teams. They each I am sure contributed to the plans, stated their visions and goals, but aides write those things.
Second - you made the page count status statement here - I think Janis’ reply is valid. Because your statement came off sort of like “his is bigger.” Substance over style. Substance over size.
I think the “content-lite” myth stems not from his having plans, but from his speeches and the debates. I was a writer and a moderator for the Kerry campaign blog in ‘04. I can not tell you how many times people would say on that blog, but he doesn’t have a plan. On Kerry’s care, it was different, he was full of details in his speeches and debates, but the media suppressed a lot of his message.
When Hillary Clinton speaks at a rally she has a stump speech filed with substance. She also out debates him because she knows her stuff and rattles it off, where as Obama mulls things and responds frequently in platitudes. A lot of people see this.
Obama supporters should not be offended but instead they should speak up and say we want more from our candidate.
I really appreciated this. I agree with you…Hillary for President!
The Democrats need to head the Republicans off RIGHT NOW with this “surrender” slander thay are already trying to swiftboat Democrats with. They need to be given hard rebuttal right back, right now. Remind McCain of his speech to the Senate in 1980s when he was one of three Republicans who opposed Reagan in going into Lebanon.Everything he said then could be asserted of the Iraq war now and it shows what a flip flopper and hypocrite John McCain is. The Democrats had better not let the Republicans get a jump on them. Please stand up and fight NOW, not later, and don’t let this surrender thing (slander attack) get put into the public mind. If we didn’t learn from John Kerry’s being slandered, when will we ever learn anything? You need to remind the public that it was Republicans who surrendered and cut and run in Vietnam. It was a very similar situation to that we have now, which the Republicans well know. Don’t let 24 yours go by without a reunttal on this kind of slander or else Democrats will lose the election again by being passive and letting the Republican dirty tricks go unanswered.
HILLARY WILL WIN SHE BE THE PRESIDENT OF TIME. BILL CLINTON WAS A GREAT PRESIDENT AND WHAT HAPPEND IS HIS PRIVITE LIFE HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT HE DID FOR THIS COUNTRY. THAT WAS NO NOES BUSINESS JUST THIERS. I BELEIVE HE WAS SET UP ANYONE THAT WOULD SAME SOMETHING LIKE THAT FOR HER MOTHER IS SICK IN THE HEAD. HER MOTHER SHOULD BE VERY PROUD OF HER LOL.. HILLARY DIDNT DO ANYTHING TO ANYONE JUST GET HURT AND HER DAUGHTER ALSO. HILLARY HAS MY VOTE I WOULD NEVER VOTE FOR A REPUBLICAN AND NEVER HAVE. HILLARY IS WITH OUT A DOUBT IN MIND THE BEST CANDIDATE. I ALWAYS THOUGHT SHE WOULD BE A GREAT PRESENDENT, AND SHE WILL SHE IS A VERY SMART LADY! SHE WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE FOR THE MIDDLE CLASS PEOPLE THAT REPULICANS WOULD NOT EVER. HILLARY YOU OUR PRAYS AND THE LORD NOES THIS COUNTRY NEEDS OUR PRAYS AND YOU TO RUN IT. GOD BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY AND EVERYONE I NO YOU HAVE THERE VOTE TO. GO HILLARY!!!!!!!!
SORRY FOR THE TYPEOS I VERY TIRED AND COULD WRITE A BOOK OF WHY I THINK HILLARY SOULD BE PRESIDENT. I AM SURE PEOPLE SOULD GET MY POINT SO SORRY.
Thanks for the reasoned response Pamela, I can see how what I said might have come off a bit like that. If anything, I wish the numbers had been closer, I wasn’t trying to imply anything based on them except that they both had plenty of information. I didn’t mean to imply that they were written by the candidates themselves (although I do admit I worded it that way).
If the issue was with he said in debates, I wonder why that wasn’t mentioned earlier. I’m going to say I disagree with you about them, but the debates are more a matter of perception in my opinion.
Hi Angie
Welcome to The Dem Daily. It’s easier to read when you don’t type in all caps.
Trevor
I’ve seen others say they don’t think he’s as strong in the debates. Once we set our hearts on a candidate, however it’s often easy to to blinded by our support. I’ve been there done that. I prefer Hillary in the this election, I think she’s the stronger candidate on many levels. I’ll be happy to support whoever the nominee is and work to get that person in the White House. I hope Obama supporters will feel the same way, if the nominee is Hillary.
John Lorenz
“If we didn’t learn from John Kerry’s being slandered, when will we ever learn anything?”
Good question. We need to gear up to fight the machine. The longer this drags out the tougher.
Janis,
Are you one of the unpaid staffers? Do you just blog pro-Hillary junk all day? So, let me get this straight: Hillary should not be honest and say her vote on Iraq was a mistake because it would feed the Republicans? Stooping to their level is the way to go? That is the kind of leadership we need? Give me a break!
HILLARY NEED TO RELEASE HER TAX RETURNS!!!
Mike Remer
Are you an unpaid staffer for Obama? Or maybe you are a paid staffer for the RNC? Why do you come here with this anit-Clinton tripe?
You insult our readers with that line of B.S.
I’ve noticed something that both sides tend to do, but sadly it’s predominantly done by supporters of the candidates, not the candidates themselves. Both sides tend to get amazingly defensive every time their candidate is criticized, and then proceed to criticize in the exact same way. I see nothing wrong with criticism, as long as it is based on facts.
One of the reasons that I don’t support some of the Clinton claims is the way in which they twist (ie horribly mutilate) facts. I’m not trying to say that the Clintons do this this all the time, or even most of the time. But some of the comments made just point out to me that they’re willing to ignore the truth so that they can twist things. (As a lawyer herself, and obviously an intelligent person, it should have been clear to Hillary that Obama did not represent a slumlord).
What differentiates the two candidates in my mind is that while Obama has been against using negative tactics, when he does use them they are based on solid fact (from what I’ve seen). Now, how that fact is spun, that’s for people to argue over, but he doesn’t twist the facts. The Clintons have blatantly done so on a couple occasions, such as the Rezko thing and the comments about Reagan. I’m not saying they shouldn’t have brought them up, in fact, I encourage it. What I am saying is that they should have brought them up in a way that was truthful. The way that they have done it I think will only weaken them in my opinion.
I’m attempting to remain civil, because I think that when we start sniping at each other it causes conversation to degenerate into meaningless back and forth bickering. (In response to the unpaid staffer remarks)
I think it’s sad that anyone who seems to hold a differing opinion is immediately labeled and ridiculed. This applies both ways. I want to hold an intelligent debate. If you can convince me that I should vote for Hillary then do so, but don’t alienate me and others by belittling us and stating things in absolutes. Obama supporters are often guilty of this as well, please don’t take this as a personal attack on Hillary supporters, I just prefer it if discussion is based on reason rather than gut punches.
Oh I do hope that Hillary wins!!! I think.. no .. i know she’s the bset for the job!!! Go Hillary!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlATFrHhMQc
If you want Democrats to WIN the 2008 election in November, you got to vote for Hillary. There is no one, no one better than Hillary to beat McCain! I’m glad you made a 180 degree turn, and i’m glad that you had this vision. I am a HUGE supporter of Hillary! I casted my vote to Hillary on Super Tuesday in NJ. She earned my highest respect!
HILLARY WILL BE THE NEXT PRESDENT! I
GO HILLARY!!!!!
It was so refereshing to come to this site and read positives about Hillary. I am so personally involved in this campaign. I can’t wait to go home and turn on the TV but then I hear MSNBC and CNN Hillary Bash. Almost worse that FOX. It sickens me. Except for Dan Abrams. He is fair. He even has been calling out the pundits for Hillary bashing. He said Obama’s positive press was 81% to Hillary’s 53%. He wants to know why too!
Bill Clinton gave me hope in the 90’s. I felt safe, secure, I felt like I could pay my bills, afford gas, the nations around the world loved us. The last 7 years has been hell on earth. I want that “feeling” again. I know I will have that with Hillary. I have never donated to a campaign before. When I read about her running low on money I went right to the computer and gave $100 and bought some hats and stuff. I felt like I helped because hours later on the news they said the Clinton campaign reported generating $4,000,000 in February too. I hope other people help with donations too! I also watched on MSNBC last night Headliners and Legends “Hillary Clinton”. How fascinating a woman she is. If you just listen to what she has done, not just in the last 15 years but since she was a kid. She knew then she was destined to dedicate her life to causes. One of her friends mothers was quoted as saying that “when she listened to Hillary’s commencement speech, her daughter told her, listen closely, she will probably be President of the United States someday!!!! GO HILLARY!!!
I can tell you all as someone who did vote for Obama in one of the early primaries, his allure does fade. Idealism is great if you are Oprah, and can afford it, but how many of us on here can actally afford to be idealistic right now? We need a plan and Hillary has it. If you’re still undecided, go out and look at their voting records. That’s what I did after I blindly voted and then realized I had made a mistake. And by the way to the man in Georgia, my husband and I were a house divided, too. He voted for Hillary. I voted for Obama and now he’s saying, “I told you so.”
Oh, well, I guess he can be right once in a while. ;.)))))))
Another point to argue. Kerry was up about 15 points ahead in March of 2004 over Bush. Enter Swiftboat. Need I say more?
Don’t look at those matchup polls from “Time.” Instead, think about what’s happened in past campaigns and how dirt is likley to be flung. We already pretty much know everything about Hillary. And Remember, folks, the Clintons survived three investigations and they could pin NOTHING ON THEM excect for Bill and Monica Lewinksy. If you watched that bio on her on MSNBC last night, she was devistated over that. You can’t blame a woman for her husband’s indescretions. A lot of us have been there, and a lot of men have been cheated on, too, so think of how you felt.
Also, Hillary can stand on that stage next to John McCain and say, “I voted for the war, too, John. I wasn’t soft on terror. Now, it’s time to bring our troops home.” Barack can’t make that argument, and that is the argument John McCain plans to make against him if he runs. McCain made that point yesterday.
I encourage everyone who is thinking of voting for Obama to do yourself a favor. Think about how campaigns are run historically, and think about who really has the means to get “change” done in Washington. Read their voting records. Don’t get caught up in the spin or who is “cool.” Don’t give your vote to the wrong person like I did.
Mike, I blog pro-Hillary sense from time to time. When you clearly spend a deal of your time blogging just as well, that’s a bit like the pot and the kettle, now isn’t it?
Trans.: “How dare you blog at all when you disagree with me!”
Yea, I am glad to find this site too as my usual progressive spots (Daily Kos, Buzzflash, Air America) are all swept up in Obama-mania.
I read from a Florida voter that though none of the candidates campaigned there, citizens could on their own read up on the candidates and vote for them. Hillary won there by a lot. What’s controversial about how those votes were tallied?
I feel she is getting the shaft by the media and unbelievable hostility from Obama supporters, but she is gracious and standing up as she has done for 15 years. Go Hillary!
Don’t you people understand?! She authorized the WAR IN IRAQ! Obama spoke out against the war at the height of insanity AND won a seat on the U.S. Senate. Barack Obama is a candidate who can be RIGHT and WIN. Moral courage in the face of overwhelming pressure isn’t something that comes from experience.
The People need a distinct candidate that contrasts McCain who voted for the war and mentioned staying in Iraq for 100 years. Do you think he’s going to let the public forget how Hillary voted on the war? Can anyone say flip flopper?! How about calling Iran’s army a terrorist group? It almost seems like Mrs. Clinton WANTS another war.
Barack Obama has the moral high ground and the capacity to bring voters outside of the Party into the fold. We don’t need a MASTER of a corrupt system that ties money to influence. We need a REFORMER who will challenge the system while simultaneously promoting greater participation. Only HOPE and INSPIRATION can turn voters out in such huge numbers. Honestly, how has Hillary Clinton improved your attitude?
What? You dislike Bush even more? Bush/Cheney/Rove merely took advantage of the system. Removing them doesn’t change that and electing Hillary would perpetuate that system (why change the rules when you know you can win as they are?). We need someone who will open the government and return it to the People. (One example of this is Obama’s plan to hold the negotiations with the drug and insurance companies public when crafting universal health care policy. How is that for bringing the sunlight of TRUTH to Washington?)
COLMustard159
Do you think McCain will let the public, particularly the Republican voting public forget that Obama claims to be the “anti-war candidate” but he voted to fund the war and voted against Kerry Feingold?
He will hit Obama with that over and over and over again, painting Obama as a “flip-flopper”.
Yo’ Reality check. I know there is a lot of passion out there–some of it real and some of it paid for. But let’s face some facts, pleasant or not.
Obama has a couple big problems, facing him. And he may not be in this race for much longer because of them.
Being a self-proclaimed anti-Establishment candidate of change–who is unanimously praised by the Establishment media–is paradoxical–but not the Senator’s biggest problem.
Increasingly detailed reports appearing in the London Times, Guardian, and Independent on the Barry Obama’s borderline legal dealings with organized crime figure Tony Rezko are hard to explain away and will be in the US press soon enough. Karl Rove prays to his Satan for an Obama-Rezko ticket.
The Wall St./City of London nasties have Mussolini Mike Bloomberg waiting in the wings to capitalize if the Dems nominate Barry Obama, I fear.
Either as an independent or through buying a spot on the ailing, elderly McCain’s ticket–Bloomberg is the current fascist threat to succeed the fascist-leaning Cheney-Bush regime.
Janis:
Nice twist of words there, now I know you are part of HC’s campaign. Obviously you can tell from my posts which are all done at night when I am done working that I am not a pro/paid blogger. You are on this site all day. The “translation” as you call it in regards to me being against anyone with a differing opinion is misleading and false. I respect those with opposing views when they are backed by either intelligent insight and/or fact. You don’t answer my questions directly but prefer to dodge them and throw out other garbage to distract.
Pamela:
You insult your readers when you spoon feed them straight from the Hillary campaign press release room. You insult the intelligence of others when you have posts that describe Obama as a “Michael Jackson rock star” etc.
Fact is Hillary won’t admit her vote on the war was wrong, because it reflects poorly on her judgement. Judgement which Obama has and used to speak out when it was a political liability to do so. You say it is because the Repubs will be all over her. Doesn’t she say she is the ONLY candidate who can stand up to them and has been taking incoming for 15 years? Do you really think they won’t bring up that she voted for the war and then changed her mind when public opinion went the other way? And if she is going to take credit for having experience by being the first lady, should she not release the papers from that period of time (the papers her husband asked NOT to be released) so we can see how much influence she had? I already stated she did NOT have a security clearance, and we all know she screwed up her healthcare plan. As far as experience goes, Obama has been an elected official for longer. Obama has released his tax returns form last year and she says she WONT until she is the nominee. So much for transparency and change. How about the Nevada caucus where Hillary went around the union (who backed Obama) to try to change workers minds by buddying up to popular elected officials there. How about Bill showing up at 3 large casinos during the caucus. Don’t you think that is influencing voters? How about Florida where all candidates pledged NOT to campaign there, yet Hillary’s name was on the ballot and she declared victory there? Is this really o.k. with you?Deep down do you not feel a twinge of unease?