Comments on: Thou Shalt Not Steal http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/ Political News, Progressive Commentary, Liberal Opinions and Common Sense Conversation... Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:09:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Pamela Leavey http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12787 Pamela Leavey Tue, 03 Jun 2008 02:40:23 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12787 AC-n-NC Sorry but here at The Dem Daily it is absolutely NO to McCain in '08. AC-n-NC

Sorry but here at The Dem Daily it is absolutely NO to McCain in ‘08.

]]> By: AC-n-NC http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12783 AC-n-NC Tue, 03 Jun 2008 01:55:05 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12783 Hillary or McCain 08 !!!!!!!!!! NO Barack Obama !!! No means No.! Hillary or McCain 08 !!!!!!!!!!
NO Barack Obama !!!
No means No.!

]]> By: Pamela Leavey http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12666 Pamela Leavey Mon, 02 Jun 2008 02:17:33 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12666 Beachmom 10's of thousands did vote in the FL and MI primary and frankly name recognition or not, it's not fair that the delegates have split this way. I say this a Democrat not a Clinton supporter. Personally, I'll be supporting the nominee, as I have said here many times and have stressed to our readers, I hope they will be too. Beachmom

10’s of thousands did vote in the FL and MI primary and frankly name recognition or not, it’s not fair that the delegates have split this way. I say this a Democrat not a Clinton supporter.

Personally, I’ll be supporting the nominee, as I have said here many times and have stressed to our readers, I hope they will be too.

]]> By: beachmom http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12635 beachmom Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:00:09 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12635 I've stayed away a long time, but now feel I need to weigh in. Both sides "lost" yesterday, in that it was a compromise. Voters in Michigan and Florida were told their votes would not count -- my parents in Florida, who favored Obama but are registered Independent -- did not bother changing party affiliation to vote in the primary because they thought it did not count. (And they are left leaning Independents, who will definitely be voting Dem in November) They DID come out to vote that day, because there was a property tax initiative on the ballot, but understanding full well that Florida had been stripped of ALL of its delegates, my parents did not vote in the primary. Similarly, I have a friend in Michigan who was not allowed to vote for Obama because he was not on the ballot -- because everyone was told Michigan would not count. In case you didn't notice, Clinton has a high name recognition and owns the party machine in many states, including Florida and Michigan. Obama, the insurgent candidate, had to create his own grassroots organizations in states in order to compete which he did superbly. He was not allowed to do that in FL and MI; it doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that Clinton had an overwhelming advantage over Obama because of her machine and name recognition. Obama is better known now, but back in January, not so much. Therefore, it is patently unfair that the rules were changed midstream. Had we known in January that the delegates would have been 50% counted, then both sides would have campaigned there, and more people would have come out to vote. So what to you is "stealing" is to me giving Clinton a HUGE favor for counting delegates that we were told would never count. As to the complaints on Michigan: blame the state Michigan party. They are the ones who came up with the numbers, not the Obama campaign who wanted a 50/50 split for an illegitimate primary (so they didn't get what they wanted either). You guys need to figure out what you want to do, but if this goes on much longer, we can look forward to a President McCain. John Kerry has been doing a great job as surrogate for Obama, what with McCain making gaffes every other week. I definitely think this general election is winnable (and remember polls this early are not indicators of what will happen in November when McCain's negatives will have gone way up), BUT we need to start getting busy in softening McCain up. I do hope Hillary concedes next week for the good of her and her supporters, as well as the party. I don't ever want to see something like this again: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KACQuZVAE3s The sooner this nominating process comes to a close, the sooner cooler minds will prevail. I’ve stayed away a long time, but now feel I need to weigh in. Both sides “lost” yesterday, in that it was a compromise. Voters in Michigan and Florida were told their votes would not count — my parents in Florida, who favored Obama but are registered Independent — did not bother changing party affiliation to vote in the primary because they thought it did not count. (And they are left leaning Independents, who will definitely be voting Dem in November) They DID come out to vote that day, because there was a property tax initiative on the ballot, but understanding full well that Florida had been stripped of ALL of its delegates, my parents did not vote in the primary. Similarly, I have a friend in Michigan who was not allowed to vote for Obama because he was not on the ballot — because everyone was told Michigan would not count. In case you didn’t notice, Clinton has a high name recognition and owns the party machine in many states, including Florida and Michigan. Obama, the insurgent candidate, had to create his own grassroots organizations in states in order to compete which he did superbly. He was not allowed to do that in FL and MI; it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to understand that Clinton had an overwhelming advantage over Obama because of her machine and name recognition. Obama is better known now, but back in January, not so much. Therefore, it is patently unfair that the rules were changed midstream. Had we known in January that the delegates would have been 50% counted, then both sides would have campaigned there, and more people would have come out to vote. So what to you is “stealing” is to me giving Clinton a HUGE favor for counting delegates that we were told would never count. As to the complaints on Michigan: blame the state Michigan party. They are the ones who came up with the numbers, not the Obama campaign who wanted a 50/50 split for an illegitimate primary (so they didn’t get what they wanted either).

You guys need to figure out what you want to do, but if this goes on much longer, we can look forward to a President McCain. John Kerry has been doing a great job as surrogate for Obama, what with McCain making gaffes every other week. I definitely think this general election is winnable (and remember polls this early are not indicators of what will happen in November when McCain’s negatives will have gone way up), BUT we need to start getting busy in softening McCain up. I do hope Hillary concedes next week for the good of her and her supporters, as well as the party. I don’t ever want to see something like this again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KACQuZVAE3s

The sooner this nominating process comes to a close, the sooner cooler minds will prevail.

]]> By: coldH2Owi http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12631 coldH2Owi Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:10:33 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12631 Stuart O'Neill: Thanks for actually seeing & hearing & commenting on the behavior of Sen. Clinton's supporters. It was embarrassing for any Democrat to see & hear. I sure hope other Sen. Clinton supporters feel as bad about the behavior in that room as you do. Stuart O’Neill:
Thanks for actually seeing & hearing & commenting on the behavior of Sen. Clinton’s supporters. It was embarrassing for any Democrat to see & hear. I sure hope other Sen. Clinton supporters feel as bad about the behavior in that room as you do.

]]> By: Stuart O'Neill http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12628 Stuart O'Neill Sun, 01 Jun 2008 16:18:23 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12628 I watched every minute of that meeting yesterday. Frankly the Clinton shouters and screamers, and Pam and others who said the room had a lot of Clinton supporters in it were correct, were out of line many times. A Party committee meeting can have audience reactions without the horrid screaming and chanting from the crowd. Senator Clinton, I'm certain, would not have approved of the conduct of some immediately after the Michigan settlement. Do I think it fair that Hillary lose 4 delegates in the process? No.. Do I think that outcome is better than simply eliminating the entire delegation? Yes. Did the committee come back with a far more fair outcome than I anticipated? Oh hell yes. I was worried about a much more draconian outcome. As to those who were ejected from the meeting: If a person stands up and obnoxiously continues a protest they are going to be ejected. It wouldn't have matter which side the protester was on., I've been on the receiving end of enough protest violence to know that the people I saw on TV at the end of the proceedings were out of line. The RBC did their best in a horrid situation. They deserve respect for the painful work they had to do at a difficult time. As one commentator repeated over and over again, he was happy the American people finally got a view of how politics really works on The Hill, in committee etc. Ickes did Hillary Clinton <em>no</em> favors with his closing remarks. They made me cringe and I'm a die-hard Clinton supporter. Hillary herself said the Presidential Primary will be over sometime next week. Mounting a credentials challenge on behalf of the states may make some sense. The states have that right. Mounting a credentials challenge on behalf of a candidate does not. If the nomination comes down to just four votes combined with extreme anger and emotional investment on each side then I think we do think we risk fracturing the Party. Anybody that called themselves a<strong> Democrat</strong> who, as a result of an outcome, then votes for <em>4 more years of death and destruction in Irag <strong>was no Democrat</strong> at any point.</em> The only unavoidable outcome of that action is the continuing <strong>death of OUR men and women</strong> in Iraq. That's an unacceptable reality. Will I suddenly become an Obama idealist? No. Will I work hard to insure that we win in November. <em>YES!</em> <strong>And so will a woman named<em> Hillary Clinton</em>.</strong>. I watched every minute of that meeting yesterday. Frankly the Clinton shouters and screamers, and Pam and others who said the room had a lot of Clinton supporters in it were correct, were out of line many times.

A Party committee meeting can have audience reactions without the horrid screaming and chanting from the crowd. Senator Clinton, I’m certain, would not have approved of the conduct of some immediately after the Michigan settlement.

Do I think it fair that Hillary lose 4 delegates in the process? No..
Do I think that outcome is better than simply eliminating the entire delegation? Yes.
Did the committee come back with a far more fair outcome than I anticipated? Oh hell yes. I was worried about a much more draconian outcome.

As to those who were ejected from the meeting: If a person stands up and obnoxiously continues a protest they are going to be ejected. It wouldn’t have matter which side the protester was on., I’ve been on the receiving end of enough protest violence to know that the people I saw on TV at the end of the proceedings were out of line.

The RBC did their best in a horrid situation. They deserve respect for the painful work they had to do at a difficult time. As one commentator repeated over and over again, he was happy the American people finally got a view of how politics really works on The Hill, in committee etc.

Ickes did Hillary Clinton no favors with his closing remarks. They made me cringe and I’m a die-hard Clinton supporter.

Hillary herself said the Presidential Primary will be over sometime next week. Mounting a credentials challenge on behalf of the states may make some sense. The states have that right. Mounting a credentials challenge on behalf of a candidate does not.

If the nomination comes down to just four votes combined with extreme anger and emotional investment on each side then I think we do think we risk fracturing the Party.

Anybody that called themselves a Democrat who, as a result of an outcome, then votes for 4 more years of death and destruction in Irag was no Democrat at any point. The only unavoidable outcome of that action is the continuing death of OUR men and women in Iraq. That’s an unacceptable reality.

Will I suddenly become an Obama idealist? No. Will I work hard to insure that we win in November. YES! And so will a woman named Hillary Clinton..

]]> By: Lucille Arneson http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12627 Lucille Arneson Sun, 01 Jun 2008 15:56:49 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12627 The will of the people is reflected in the popular vote, not this crazy way of selecting delegates that varies from state to state, not to mention the results of the arcane caucus system. The DNC has outlived its purpose by wrongfully rewarding an unqualifed zombie. It's time to bury it. If Hillary Clinton is not selected as the Democratic candidate, I'm off to defeat the unqualified one in November. It's that simple. Yes I will! The will of the people is reflected in the popular vote, not this crazy way of selecting delegates that varies from state to state, not to mention the results of the arcane caucus system. The DNC has outlived its purpose by wrongfully rewarding an unqualifed zombie. It’s time to bury it.

If Hillary Clinton is not selected as the Democratic candidate, I’m off to defeat the unqualified one in November. It’s that simple. Yes I will!

]]> By: *I* Didn’t Leave the Democrat Party, the Party Left *Me* « Semidi http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12626 *I* Didn’t Leave the Democrat Party, the Party Left *Me* « Semidi Sun, 01 Jun 2008 15:19:00 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12626 [...] Democratic Daily: “Thou Shalt Not Steal” [...] [...] Democratic Daily: “Thou Shalt Not Steal” [...]

]]> By: AC-n-NC http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12625 AC-n-NC Sun, 01 Jun 2008 14:24:06 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12625 I am so ashamed of the DNC and RBC. Taking delagates from a candidate that did nothing wrong and give them to someone that took his name off the ballot. Unbelievable. Hillary or McCain baby.!!!! I am so ashamed of the DNC and RBC. Taking delagates from a candidate that did nothing wrong and give them to someone that took his name off the ballot. Unbelievable.
Hillary or McCain baby.!!!!

]]> By: Pamela Leavey http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12610 Pamela Leavey Sun, 01 Jun 2008 06:31:21 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12610 JP Also FYI, No one campaigned in either MI or FL. What is fair is that the votes of the people count for something. The DNC is wrong on this and I would say so as an Obama supporter too. JP

Also FYI, No one campaigned in either MI or FL.

What is fair is that the votes of the people count for something. The DNC is wrong on this and I would say so as an Obama supporter too.

]]> By: Pamela Leavey http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12608 Pamela Leavey Sun, 01 Jun 2008 06:29:02 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12608 JP Chris Dodd, Mike Gravel and Dennis Kucinich were also on the ballot in MI, FYI. JP

Chris Dodd, Mike Gravel and Dennis Kucinich were also on the ballot in MI, FYI.

]]> By: JP http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/comment-page-1/#comment-12599 JP Sun, 01 Jun 2008 05:50:32 +0000 http://thedemocraticdaily.com/2008/05/31/thou-shalt-not-steal/#comment-12599 it's also no-no to change th rules of the process mid-stream. how fair is that?? especially when the change benefits one party more than the other!! you do see how this could appear differently to others---not just a "count every vote" issue but one of fairness to those who campaigned for a nomination based on certain rules that were agreed to. it’s also no-no to change th rules of the process mid-stream. how fair is that?? especially when the change benefits one party more than the other!! you do see how this could appear differently to others—not just a “count every vote” issue but one of fairness to those who campaigned for a nomination based on certain rules that were agreed to.

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